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Doctor Who: Wibbly-Wobbly Timey-Wimey Stuff

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  • Doctor Who: Wibbly-Wobbly Timey-Wimey Stuff


    There is a new Doctor. His name is Peter Capaldi. There is where we discuss it, I guess.

  • #2
    More info on Capaldi:

    I am still not reconciled about Idris Elba.



    • #3
      I should probably stop groaning about Elba, since it's entirely possible that *he* turned them down.

      While we try to learn everything we can about new Doctor Who star Peter Capaldi, Who writer Neil Gaiman has revealed that another actor was offered the gig first — but turned it down.

      The extremely interesting part? It was apparently a black actor, which would've made for the first non-white dude to play the iconic sci-fi role. Now, Gaiman declined to reveal exactly who was ahead of Capaldi on the short list, but at least one name jumps to mind.

      Ass-kicking Prometheus and Luther star Idris Elba has been rumored ever since Matt Smith announced his exit, so he’s definitely an option. Apart from that, there’s no telling who Moffat might’ve had in mind.

      Here is Gaiman’s bombshell-filled response via Tumblr when asked if he thinks an actor of another race will ever take over the TARDIS:

      “Of course. (I thought I’d said that I was disappointed that it didn’t happen this time, and that there are some amazing actors out there. I was rather disappointed that Paterson Joseph didn’t get it last time, although I’ve loved Matt’s Eleven.) And yes, I have no doubt there will be. (I know one black actor who was already offered the part of the Doctor, and who turned it down.) Just as there will be a female Doctor.”

      Sure, we’re excited to see what Capaldi can do with a sonic screwdriver, but it’s a little disappointing to think the 12th Doctor could’ve been the one to break the race barrier.

      So who do you think got the offer? Elba, or someone else?
      Well, fine.


      • #4
        Elba would have been fantastic but he probably wouldn't have the time! It's hard enough getting more Luther!


        • #5
          Why They Got It Wrong:

          First I want to say that I have been a DOCTOR WHO fan since the early ’80′s when Tom Baker was my Doctor. Over the past decades, I have been a loyal and cheerleading fan, loving each reincarnation of the Fourth Doctor through the Eleventh Doctor. I also remain optimistic about the Twelfth Doctor, who was just recently announced as being portrayed by Peter Capaldi. But tempering my excitement over the recent casting choice was the realization that DOCTOR WHO made the wrong choice. With lots of factions vying for the first female or non-white Doctor, there was certainly a lot of interest in stepping outside of the box in choosing who would portray the Twelfth Doctor. There was also a lot of interest in keeping the role youth-oriented.

          So last Sunday at precisely the designated time, I sat amongst friends as we huddle around a laptop streaming the BBC announcement of who the Twelfth Doctor would be — and the announcement was met with dead silence. No whoops of joy and excitement, just nothingness. Peter Capaldi is certainly a fine choice, especially given his DOCTOR WHO ties and his sterling performance in TORCHWOOD: Children of Earth. But there is one glaring problem: he’s just too old. It seems cruel and ridiculous that a man of 55 years of age would be too old to play The Doctor, particularly when the First Doctor William Hartnell was 55 as well. But in recent years (the critical years), each of The Doctors was portrayed by increasingly young actors. Christopher Eccleston was 41, David Tennant was 34, and Matt Smith was 27 when all were originally cast for their brief tenures as The Doctor. It was imperative that DOCTOR WHO stay on course and cast another younger actor. Why? Because in our world today, youth rules. Ask any actor who has hit their 40′s and you’ll hear the same thing: the roles are a lot harder to get. Ageism is alive in well in the entertainment industry, especially in film and television.

          After DOCTOR WHO went on its 16 year hiatus between 1989 and 2005 (not counting the 1996 film version with Paul McGann since it barely registered with fans and failed to relaunch the franchise), it seemed to hibernate due to lack of interest. But what the BBC and Russell T Davies understood in 2005 was that it was vital to cast a young actor. It can be argued that since Christopher Eccleston was 41 years of age, they were not casting all that much younger. But Christopher certainly gave off a very youthful vibe, one that has continued through the casting of David Tennant and Matt Smith; and Matt was actually 14 years young than Christopher upon taking on the mantle of The Doctor.

          Why am I emphasizing the age-factor? Because it matters. American audiences had never truly embraced the British series DOCTOR WHO until the era of David Tennant, and DOCTOR WHO only became a phenomenon widely-embraced in the U.S. during Matt Smith’s tenure as The Doctor. What made the difference were the geek fan-girls. David and Matt brought enormous amounts of sex appeal to the role. Being younger and more youthful, teenage girls and Millennials in their 20′s suddenly fell head-over-heels for The Doctor — and the top U.S. magazines took notice. For the first time ever, DOCTOR WHO was on the cover of TV Guide and Entertainment Weekly. Any TV show knows they have made the U.S. zeitgeist when they can achieve that level of notoriety. The tipping point was sex appeal. Russell T Davies exploited all the natural charm and appeal of David Tennant and wrote a poignant love story for David’s tenure as The Doctor. The love story of The Doctor and Rose had captured the hearts and imaginations of fan-girls of all ages. The internet was abuzz with fan fiction, Tumbler pages and virtual alters to worship the romance between The Doctor and Rose. Of course, with David leaving the role and a new actor coming on board, there was some frenzy that it would destroy the hopes and dreams of fan-girls everywhere. Fortunately, Russell T Davies has come up with a clever way to ensure that The Doctor/Rose romance would live forever — and fan-girls breathed a collective sigh of relief.

          Then with the entrance of Matt Smith as the Eleventh Doctor, the romance and sexual sizzle was back stronger than before. In fact, Amy Pond even tried to seduce him on the eve of her wedding night. With a nice twist, that forbidden hanky-panky was averted and Amy wed her destined true-love Rory, and the adventures of The Eleventh Doctor with Amy and Rory began. That 3-season journey also introduced the epic romance of The Doctor and River Song. The frisson of electric chemistry between them was palpable from their first moments on screen together. Now helmed by Steven Moffat, DOCTOR WHO fully embraced the era of romance (and dare we say it, sex) with The Doctor; for clearly River Song and The Doctor were spending nights together in addition to their magnificent adventures.

          So in the past 8 years, DOCTOR WHO found its world-wide appeal (particularly in the U.S.) by introducing sex and romance into its story. Sex sells, but sex appeal is priceless. DOCTOR WHO had finally hit upon the magic ingredient to lure in younger viewers, especially young female viewers. Nowhere was it more noticeable than at San Diego Comic-Con. Thousands of fans waited out overnight just for the chance to get up-close and personal with David Tennant and Matt Smith. Their screams of elation could be heard blocks away.

          But what about now? Will those same fan-girls and younger viewers feel the same desire to scream and yell for Peter Capaldi? For many, he will seem as old as their grandparents. He is not offering the same kind of appeal that David and Matt had. Peter may be able to offer some of the other necessary ingredients to portray The Doctor, but he cannot change the fact of his age. He is 24 years older than Matt Smith. That is not insignificant. All the great acting in the world won’t make up for one critical deficiency: sex appeal.

          So when Peter’s name was announced and he was welcomed on screen as the new Doctor, he was met with silence. Of all the other names in contention, in the end they had cast a much older actor. Everyone was stunned. Barely even daring to think it, everyone had a the same thought: isn’t he too old? Of all the other top fan choices, the oldest proposed actor was 42. And yet, the actual actor cast was 55 — 13 years older than anyone predicted. Even my top three picks skewed much younger: Idris Elba (40), Colin Ferguson (41) and Jordan Gavaris (23).

          Perhaps Steven Moffat was looking for the best actor for the role, which Peter is certainly a fantastic actor; but Steven got it all wrong in choosing one that could potentially lose half its audience. Those increased ratings were not simply due to curiosity and interest in science fiction; increased ratings were due to interest in the actors playing The Doctor. David Tennant and Matt Smith were able to bring the one thing that The Doctor never had before — fan girls, more importantly, U.S. fan girls. Those rising ratings were attributable to girls discovering a sci-fi hero they could root for and lust for. Someone closer to their age and one that they could pin-up on their bedroom walls. In addition to fan-girls, it also helped recruit younger viewers who could identify more with an actor closer to their age.

          Steven Moffat and Russell T Davies were clever enough to exploit the sex appeal of David Tennant and Matt Smith. But casting Peter Capaldi could slam the door shut on fans who now feel that the party is over. There will be the faction that is displeased that a woman or non-white actor wasn’t selected, which would seem negligible but for the fact that a larger faction of the DOCTOR WHO audience is now also displeased that a much older actor was cast in the role.

          Some of the key attributes that we know and love about The Doctor are his zaniness, silliness, sense of wonder and curiosity, a childlike soul, physical agility, and as of the new era, sex appeal. It is too late to turn back the clock to a time when The Doctor was merely an older gentleman collecting companions and going on amazing adventures. The new era invited audiences to fall in love with The Doctor, as a lover, not a mentor. It would be nice to think that fans will follow The Doctor on any adventure and through every incarnation, but the cold, harsh reality of the world we live in is that age matters. Appearance matters. Casting so much older will feel like a slap in the face of fans who fell in love with The Doctor. They may have accepted a woman in the role, or a non-white actor because they were prepared for a change. But no one expected this and given the new world rules created by design by Russell and Steven in selecting such younger actors to attract younger audiences, this was just the wrong choice.
          We will stand by Peter Capaldi as the Twelfth Doctor, but everyone will be thinking: how soon can we get to the Thirteen Doctor?
          Well . . . it makes me squirm to see it written out like in black and white. Such ageism! I feel like an asshole just reading it. She manages to be pretty offensive . . . to older actors, to 'fangirls', to . . . everyone, actually? It's an annoying article. Seriously annoying and abrasive.

          That said, there is some unfortunate truth there to the idea of the show perhaps taking a ratings tumble after this.

          I'm not excited about the new Doctor. Even though I knew I'd not get anyone I actually wanted, I still thought I'd be a *little* excited about the announcement . . . but yeah. The casting seems like a quaint throwback to Classic Who, and there's a reason why I have zero interest in Classic Who. It does deflate the Who casting momentum and makes me question Moffat (not that I wasn't already questioning Moffat -- everything has been so uneven since he took over!). If this had been a Davies decision instead of a Moffat decision, I might have had more confidence in it. Moffat has lost so much of my trust already, though.

          I want to be openminded about the very nice and very talented middle-aged gentleman that is taking over as the Doctor and not be an ageist jerk.

          I REALLY WANT TO. I hope he surprises me, but I am not going to lie . . . I crushed on Ecclestone, Tennant and (lesser-ly) on Smith and it's a *little* harder to imagine crushing on Capaldi. I'm accustomed to being swoony about my Doctor. I *like* being swoony about him. I don't want that to matter to me, but it might, considering how disappointing the past season was (let's be honest) in actual writing and production. There were many eps that I felt were only carried through based on how charming Matt Smith was personally. I'm willing for Capaldi to charm me, though! Maybe he has charm in spades. Age is much less important to me than maintaining the Doctor's je ne sais quoi.

          In a general way, I can't see Capaldi's Doctor getting the same level of ratings as Matt Smith's and that is not good for a show that is also being thought of (in many circles) as being in a quality decline. Just an odd (clueless) decision from a biz perspective. Maybe they thought they were being bold and revolutionary by going with the older white guy? Like, 'everyone expects xyz so we will give them abc'? But it doesn't feel like that was the intent.

          I'm confuzzled.


          • #6
            Kate Linnea, who I quite like, attacks the above article on some very valid grounds:

            Hey, women, stop perpetuating the "fake geek girl" myth!

            Today this essay started popping up on my Twitter feed and promptly enraged me and several of my friends, but really, it's just the latest example of a genre that crops up far, far too often. In it, the (female) writer expresses her very serious worry that Stephen Moffat and the BBC have risked the entire Doctor Who franchise by casting an "all wrong" person as the twelfth Doctor - and by "all wrong" she means not that Peter Capaldi* is another white male, but that he's a white male who isn't young and hot enough. She states that the show's popularity is due to the sex appeal of the last three Doctors and that this casting means it will "potentially lose half its audience."

            And this way of thinking, this common, common way of thinking about young women and their media consumption, well, it makes me want to throw things. Because it does a terrible disservice to everyone, really, but specifically to those young women and to young girls coming of age in this society that assumes that they can't actually like something because it's good, that they can only be lured in by pretty boys and pandering to their shallow - young women must be shallow, you know - frivolous interests. Did having attractive people on the show help grow Doctor Who's audience? Sure. (You know what else has attractive people? Virtually every show on TV.) Is having a lust object literally the only reason for young women to watch a science fiction show? No! That's ridiculous! Apparently this might be a shocking statement, but I swear, young women will watch shows they like, and they'll like things for any number of different reasons. It's almost like they're people or something.

            But no, of course young women couldn't watch a science fiction show because they like science fiction. People like the writer of the above essay (and there are many; this is just the one that pushed me over the edge) are careful to say that they themselves like the show on its own merits, of course, but everyone else, all those FAKE geek girls, they must be the majority and they can't possibly be watching for the "right" reasons, and therefore they must be patronized and pandered to at every opportunity. It's infuriating enough when men say things like this, but seriously, women, stop spreading this nonsense about other women. You're not making yourself look better by claiming you're not one of "them." You're just making things worse for everyone, because by reinforcing the idea that young women have a very narrow range of interests, you're encouraging people to make a narrow range of entertainment options for all of us. And by saying women will only watch a Doctor who's young and hot, you're giving every man - and woman - who's looking for it permission to dismiss the opinions of the women at their gaming stores, at their conventions, in their lives, and to take for granted that the women around them aren't really people with a right to be there, because they're just "fake geek girls."

            * I don't want to get too far into the specifics of any actors, as that's not really my point here, but I'll just say that I think Capaldi is very talented (and, you know, attractive, which it IS possible for someone over the age of 41 to be!) and I've quite liked him in other things, and I'm looking forward to seeing him in the role.
            All of which I agree with.

            That said, as much as I like the scifi timey wimey stuff, the hotness factor (of the Doctor, but also of Rose and Amy and Rory and Clara and River and whomever) was a super nice element as well. If the show was still firing on all cylinders, I don't think I'd have any concerns about this casting. As it is NOT, it makes me wonder. You needed to stack the deck, Moffat, and create additional excitement and that hasn't happened.

            But! The article itself was very galling, no doubt.
            Last edited by ophy; 08-08-2013, 06:30 PM.


            • #7
              I'm not sure how much the BBC truly care about the American audience so those bloggers should probably consider that.

              I still consider it a kids show. It airs at 6pm on a Saturday here and gets about 7 million viewers.

              I don't think that they offered the part to a black actor this time round, I think it was before Matt Smith got the role.
              Bitter Shipper


              • #8
                I wondered about that part . . . the whole 'you wouldn't have *American* fan girls without a hot young Doctor' argument is vastly undercut if nobody involved cares in the slightest about American fan girls anyway.

                I don't think that they offered the part to a black actor this time round, I think it was before Matt Smith got the role.
                I think you are right. It doesn't feel like they considered anyone very seriously except for Capaldi this time.

                I still consider it a kids show.
                Too funny. It's primetime here, not in a kid's slot at all. All in the packaging, I guess!


                • #9
                  50th Anniversary poster!



                  "The Day of The Doctor". I'm all a-tingle at the thought of Tennant and Smith on screen together. There's some nice deets in there, but nothing overly spoilery.


                  • #10


                    “The Day of the Doctor,” starring Smith, Jenna Louise-Coleman, David Tennant, Billie Piper and John Hurt, will be simultcast worldwide on Nov. 23.


                    • #11
                      ANOTHER TRAILER:



                      • #12
                        Well, this was disappointing.

                        A mini-episode presquel-ish thing:


                        I did not like anything about it. I kept expecting them to draw back and show us that it was a fake play or something that the real Doctor was watching. The acting was atrocious, and the writing was way overblown, and nothing interesting happened.


                        • #13
                          Well this put it into some context for me.


                          A six-minute mini-episode of Doctor Who has been released online. The Night Of The Doctor serves as a prequel to next week’s 50th anniversary special The Day Of The Doctor.

                          That’s only Paul McGann, back as the Eighth Doctor!

                          McGann played the role just once, in the US-funded 1996 TV Movie that was not picked up for a full series. It’s widely held that his performance was pretty much the only decent thing about that movie.
                          It was widely speculated that he would be back to film his a regeneration scene in the 50th anniversary, but he denied it.

                          So he wasn’t technically lying when he said this.

                          I was a bit dismayed, a bit gutted, but [the older Doctors] are not in it. There are all kinds of rumours doing the rounds. One gets tired of trying to refute things on Twitter and the like, but – take it from me – I’m not in it.
                          So here he is, trying to rescue a young girl called Cass from a doomed spaceship.

                          But Cass does not trust him. We are clearly in the thick of the Last Great Timewar, and the Timelords and as reviled as the Daleks.
                          The Sisterhood Of Karn!

                          The Doctor and Cass crashland on Karn. We have met the Sisterhood before, in 1976’s The Brain Of Morbius. They are the keepers of a sacred flame which protects the elixir of life. The Sisterhood Of Karn is also the name of a London-based society of gay Doctor Who fans who meet once a month upstairs at the King’s Arms on Poland Street.
                          The Sisterhood are keeping the Doctor alive for now, but they offer him a terrible choice.

                          As a sidenote, a throwaway line of dialogue also confirms that the Doctor could at one point be a woman.
                          “I don’t suppose there’s any need for a Doctor anymore. Make me a warrior now.”

                          The episode also confirms what most people had suspected, that John Hurt’s previously unseen Doctor came after the Eighth, and was the one forced to commit genocide against his own people to end the Timewar.
                          He knows what he has to do.

                          Before going, he salutes Charley, C’rizz, Lucie, Tamsin and Molly, the companions who accompanied him on his audio and comic-book adventures when the show was off air.
                          Well, golly, context sure helps!

                          So it was basically something only actual Whovians would understand and pick up on. Okay! Way to make the reboot-only fans feel stupid!

                          And hey, that's sort of fair, I guess? They do have 50 yrs worth of history, and I've only been watching since Christopher Ecclestone. My fault, clearly.

                          (I still think the writing on it was too florid and that the acting came off cheesy supreme with extra cheese.)


                          • #14
                            New preview clip!

                            Now this was fun.


                            • #15
                              Kinda funny that I can't watch Doctor Who today because the kids are home, and yet linda swears it's a kid's show in the UK. I don't know what that says about American parenting vs. UK parenting, but it's still way too scary for mine.

                              We're doing Teen Beach Movie instead, while I scour tumblr looking for Day of The Doctor spoiler gifs.